A Crash Course in Commercial AP System Design

[MingJohan]

Personally I prefer In line pumps for longevity. But that's me.

I also like the combination of both trickle and a moving bed.

What do others think?

Cheers.

I will go with inline pumps, it's easier obtainable in the Philippines.... How ever that's only me.


BR

Johan

[ande]

Hi all
I'm following the thread developement with intrest, the tiltle of the thread is maybe a bit missleading ? "building a course" it's turned more towards building a spesific type of system rather than a course IMO.

Good positive thread thoug.
EG you asked for input from EU or other places, I'm in Norway wich is associated member of EU, the system in this thread and the species (fish/plant) and prices $ on the end product along side the climate in north Europe makes it not suitable to begin with IMO.

But the aproach towards systematicaly collect and gather information and prices before starting a commercial venture in AP, is great.
Anyhow those living in a colder climate might find this useful http://www.rainbowfish.se/index.html it's a Swedish AP operation started back in 1997 (trout/perch) the updates stops around 2008 and some good info is not there anymore.

I enjoy the developement and will chip in when or iff I think it's of intrest.

Pump I say inline, or airlift pump.

keep up the good work

cheers

[JohnMc]

EG,

check you email. Just sent you pricing and projections on hollow block troughs, PVC fittings, pipe, pumps in USD$.

[JohnMc]

The title might be a little off right now. But one has to have a model. One could then gather the components for operations, husbandry, marketing from various sources on the web consistent with the model. Patience comes to mind.

[JohnMc]

You don't need narrower troughs, though you could, just cut the boards to whatever size you need that is a multiple of the trough width. The rafts would be well mannered even at 2x4' in a 8' width trench. Its practised all the time in DWC culture.

[GaryD]

Hi Paul,

Generally when we build the combo filters, the trickle sits over the sump and cycles on the sump so it can be bypassed if needed or as the densities come up more water can be put through it.

Yes......that's my preferred way of doing it, too.

For some reason, my mind was fixed on having them over the fish tank.

I agree with the observation that we are no longer planning a commercial AP course.

Paul, you're doing the running here......what title should I put on this thread?

Gary

[Damon]

now, lettuce is what we're concentrating on, but green onion, leeks, and scallions also do very well in the systems. one great thing about scallions and green onions is you can cut the tops and leave the plugs in the system... this can be done up to 3 times. which means a reduction is seed stock... and sing they are bulbing plants they will actually produce a perpetual seed stock... and there will come a point where you'll be producing more bulbs than you can use... which in turn will result in the sales of excess bulbs... 2 sources of income just by keeping the farm going...

just a thought there... so you really cant judge a farm viability based just on one template. just because one region is flooded with lettuce that doest mean these types of systems wont produce another product in mass... really i think green onions would be the way to go with their small growing diameter, cut and re-grow facet, and perpetual seed stock.

[Earthan Group]

All I mean is that you will not "like a idea" if you did not test it in the past or are pretty sure it will work...

Very much so but I am known for trying new things from time to time. I apologise for the name mix up as well Johan.

I will go with inline pumps, it's easier obtainable in the Philippines....

I like inline as well, easy to service in bigger operations and there are some fantastic new style pumps we have used. But as you say everyone can find these pumps everywhere easily.

Have we anyone from your region putting together some pricing for components? Are you able to help with that if we give you a list?

EG you asked for input from EU or other places, I'm in Norway wich is associated member of EU, the system in this thread and the species (fish/plant) and prices $ on the end product along side the climate in north Europe makes it not suitable to begin with IMO.

Very true some climates are going to be more difficult than others but important to get the basic system down and work up climate controls etc for different species in different areas.

Are you able to look into pricing for components near you?

Pump I say inline, or airlift pump.

I am happy to look at an air pump option but in a commercial environment I cannot vouch for their usefulness.

check you email. Just sent you pricing and projections on hollow block troughs, PVC fittings, pipe, pumps in USD$.

Thank you John. Looks great. If you don't mind, I will add the other regions to that costing sheet and we will include it as part of the free package?

The title might be a little off right now. But one has to have a model. One could then gather the components for operations, husbandry, marketing from various sources on the web consistent with the model.

Perhaps we can do a design thread or general considerations now. Then move some of the info across to a Commercial costing considerations thread and then compile that into a course type thread. At least then the info is a little easier to find??

You don't need narrower troughs, though you could, just cut the boards to whatever size you need that is a multiple of the trough width. The rafts would be well mannered even at 2x4' in a 8' width trench. Its practised all the time in DWC culture.

So perhaps we stick with the 2.4 meter wide raft tanks and say cut the foam into 1.2x1.2 meter chunks?

Yes......that's my preferred way of doing it, too.

For some reason, my mind was fixed on having them over the fish tank.

Righto so we are doing a combo filter unit? I know UVI reached limits and needed to add a degassing tower as an afterthought.

just a thought there... so you really cant judge a farm viability based just on one template. just because one region is flooded with lettuce that doest mean these types of systems wont produce another product in mass... really i think green onions would be the way to go with their small growing diameter, cut and re-grow facet, and perpetual seed stock.

No judgement on this system at all. My hope is we can put together the basics for a "have a go" type system. Put the numbers to it and the end user can make up their own mind if it is suitable for them.

Does that work for you Damon?

[ande]

EG:

Are you able to look into pricing for components near you?

Yes, I can but I would prefer to get a complete material list when ewery thing is defined.
Norway is a high cost country so some would source in Denmark,Sweden,UK............ as privat import on a lot of items
Prices would also be wery different here depending on whom you are. Iff you are a comercial company like a plumber, landscaper, building entrepenour you would probbably get whole sale prices or good rabbates 20-40% lower than a private person.
A complete material list buing all at once would be the smartest aproach to get best prices so lets get back to it?

[Damon]

paul, i was reffering to those who said this isn't about a class anymore... the point i was trying to make is you have to have something to center the class around... this template would only be a portion of the lesson... the cost analysis portion... then it would carry on to other things like market demographics, marketing, sales, product price assesments, and so on... it just so happens that building a cost analysis sheet is a big project, and as of right now that's what it looks like this thread is all about... but really it's just the first building block...

lol we have to give it time if this is meant to be a thread about a course... constructing one building block at a time, and then making our way through each part section by section...

i think we're on the right track... and it does seem system focused, but again, this is just the first of many steps necessary to put on the grand show... we're doing great, and heading in the right direction. i think to focus on too many aspects of putting on a commercial class would be disastrous... but going through each section thoroughly one at a time is the way to go to make sure things don't get over looked.

we cant expect too much too fast out of this... it takes weeks and weeks to put together this kind of information to be presented to others.. but because we have so many people working together on this, it's actually moving at light speed.