IBFP Competition

[GaryD]

Hi,

I'm keen to see this discussion about the amount of food that can be produced on 100 square metres of land turn into something useful.

To that end, we're going to run a competition and, in the interests of democracy, I'd like some suggestions about some competition conditions and what you consider might be a useful prize. I'd be happy to consider several prizes so that we cover the broadest possible range of outcomes.

Let's have your ideas ASAP!

GaryD

[Hamish]

Hi,

I'm keen to see this discussion about the amount of food that can be produced on 100 square metres of land turn into something useful.

To that end, we're going to run a competition and, in the interests of democracy, I'd like some suggestions about some competition conditions and what you consider might be a useful prize. I'd be happy to consider several prizes so that we cover the broadest possible range of outcomes.

Let's have your ideas ASAP!

GaryD
Depends on the dollars we are talking :) A water test kit is always useful - then again so is a Balcony Aquaponics kit - totally different ends of the price spectrum though :)

[Jonathan Dyer]

Everything we do in this modern society fits into 3 sections, Physical, Environmental and Financial. Keeping that in mind what I would like to see is that if one is able to grow food in 100 sq m to feed a family for an indefinite supply of food with some variety (instead of eating lettuce every day) such designs fit into a financial frame work and an approximate budget of capital works (including recycled materials), ongoing costs and food savings (or profit). All well and good of suggesting a design that may work but, the real challenge is having it fit into a financial frame work to prove it is viable.

Don’t get me wrong I do believe it can be done but only with the proper design in mind and that’s why I find it hard to believe that an average backyard is setup is such way to facilitate such system without industrial earthmoving. Think about it how many large trees you have covering the backyard, plants in random places, little room for a hothouse; given the appropriate area is clean from the start it is much easier to deal with.

[echidna]

Hi,
I'm keen to see this discussion about the amount of food that can be produced on 100 square metres of land turn into something useful.
SNIP


Well I'd already given the concept some thought last night. And this morning I paced and marked out the area. When looking at it, it's large enough to cause problems with some councils and/or fisheries if purely devoted to aquaponics unless accumulated over a lengthy period. Most acts give authorities the power to decide whether something is a "hobby" or "commercial" and it's up to you to take their unreasonable decision to court.

Then their is the issue of growing season/s. Type of food, soil type and fertility, rainfall or access to potable water. So for any contest to be fair it has to take these things into account and that requires the wisdom of Solomon. So I'd suggest a light-hearted "competition" where ideas get thrown up and people can add and subtract them to their own 100 sq. m. in their own environment. That way everyone gets to be a "winner" and the "prizewinners" are those that best explain why their approach is best for their circumstances. People can keep modifying "their" ideal scheme to the end. That way we have a resource that everyone can use - for example, I particularly like Gary's use of sattelite pots and a removable biofilter, but if someone comes up with a better idea for my circumstances then I can incorporate it and explain why I think it is better. In that way it can all be condensed down into a meaningful set of decision making protocols and someone can write the book "The Best Approaches to Integrated Backyard Food Production in 100 sq. m."

[Jonathan Dyer]

Echidna, I couldn’t agree more it is more in detail than first off thought especially the seasonal changes as well as planting times and growth rates too is gets in depth even on 100sq m.

[GaryD]

Hi,

I'd like come up with some competition conditions without being too prescriptive......so let's suspend the discussion on what would work or not until we have entries to consider.

Gary

[echidna]

Hi,

I'd like come up with some competition conditions without being too prescriptive......so let's suspend the discussion on what would work or not until we have entries to consider.

Gary

I didn't think that what I offered was prescriptive, But hey, make the rules so that we can get this intellectual process going. I for one am very interested in the offerings!

[Murray]

I think we might come up with some interesting solutions.
Is it just a plan or do we need to plant the garden or whatever.

[craigb]

100 square meters is not much room. 25*4, 20*5, 15*6.6 etc

Also will there restrictions as to the area having to be one dimensional or will it be allowable to go upwards. I'm thinking that rabbit and bird hutches could be stacked on top of one another or built under the grow beds.

Pumpkins can be grown over the roof of sheds, or over lattice on the side of a fence etc. Another question to ask is if the growing area has to be confined to a specific 100 sq area or can be 100sq in total. Eg, a citrus tree in a pot in one place, the aquaculture set up in another, the bird aviary in another. The herb garden in another etc.

[GaryD]

Hi Echidna,


I didn't think that what I offered was prescriptive....

I wasn't referring to anything you (or anyone else) said.....and I'm sorry if you misunderstood me. I'm with you......I'm keen to see where the whole discussion takes us.


Also will there restrictions as to the area having to be one dimensional or will it be allowable to go upwards....
I think that vertical stacking is certainly a part of any efficient backyard food production system.

By way of guidance.....let's agree that an Integrated Backyard Food Production system is anything that you could reasonably put together in an urban backyard.

So.....let's say we're looking at 100 square metres in area and a maximum of 3 metres high.

GaryD

[craigb]

Thanks for that Gary.

I think we need to have to expand a bit though as many older urban areas still have the traditional 1/4 acre block as a standard size. And there are other ways to think outside the box as well.

I know a greek man who lives in Parramatta - NSW who planted olive trees along the foot path of his street / cold e sac many years ago, instead of the traditional council trees.

There is a Hungarian fellow a few streets away from me who has planted some other exotic type plant on his street frontage which he uses to make jam.

Perhaps we could include a 3 way plan.
1.) 100 sq for small urban areas.
2.) Larger area for traditional 1/4 acre block
3.) Community gardening / support networks - this is where neighbors or like thinking individuals team up and share the surplus produce with each other. This might mean one would use their area to grow mainly fruit trees - the other perhaps root vegies, the other meat.

The other issue is how many people does the area have to support. A couple, family with kids / how many? etc

[Hamish]

How about we draw up a plan view of the block of land with house, driveway etc with compass so we know where the sun travels. And a description of the family we are feeding.

[inzane]

How self sufficient are we trying to make this family? Is it total, or are we aiming to reduce what they buy to say grains?

[Hamish]

I would guess the winner would be the person that gets as close to self sufficiency as possible.

[inzane]

Will there be a rough budget? Or we going to go with 'reasonable' fantasy or even total fantasy?

[Jonathan Dyer]

Here in the real world does ‘fantasy’ exist?

[GaryD]

Hi,

I began to assemble some conditions of entry for a competition and I discovered that the old adage "life wasn't meant to be easy" applies to the conduct of competitions in spades. It's a legal minefield to say the least.... and one which is complicated by our international membership.

So, here's what I propose. That rather than having a competition, we just continue the ongoing discussion of ideas.


As for prizes, the discussion is its own reward..... in that all of us will learn things we didn't know before.

Sorry if I complicated things....I do that sometimes.

Now for that discussion......Our goal is to design an Integrated Backyard Food Production unit....so that means that whatever we come up with will be located in an urban area. If I recall correctly, we were considering a 100 square metre space. Structures are limited to 4 metres in height.

What works in sub-tropical Bundamba may be a stretch in Lanark....so your plan will need to reflect your circumstances. Rather than complicating things by considering total self-sufficiency or even how many people are involved, let's just attempt to get a sense of what's possible on that space….wherever you are.

Some of the aspects that you might want to address in your IBFP plan include:
Livestock....what species.....how many?
Plants....what species.....how many?
Growing Systems....what type?
What structures will you have?
Livestock shelters
Greenhouses
Fencing and other containment systems
Rainwater capture....tanks and ponds
Workshop
Other....
Innovative features of the system
Hi Tech....Low Tech.....appropriate tech
Sustainability
Low capital cost
System automation
Other....
Any realistic estimates of productive capability and operating cost.
Anything else you can think of.Since a picture is worth a thousand words.....drawings would be particularly welcome. MS Word (or whatever you're using) will produce an acceptable drawing for the purposes of this discussion. Of course, if you're an expert on Google Sketchup, so much the better.


GaryD

[DuncanC]

Hi All,

As this thread seems to have stalled. I have an idea on how everyone could participate in the design of a single system. Taking a bit from what Hamish said, what if we specify an area, specify what we'd like to get out of it, specify general conditions and then have a group single group drawing. That way people could learn from each other and learn from designing the system. I think Gary should hold creative control over what finally goes in and what doesn't, but I'd assume he'd listen to any reasonable ideas/discussions.

What do you guys think?

Cheers,

Duncan

[GaryD]

Hi,

Thanks for reviving this thread Duncan.



I think Gary should hold creative control over what finally goes in and what doesn't, but I'd assume he'd listen to any reasonable ideas/discussions.



I'm happy to see what the discussion produces without trying to control it too much. I'd be interested in what designs might be forthcoming.

While I'd be happy to canvass any size IBFP unit, I'm particularly interested in what could be set up in an area 3m x 3m x 2.4 metres high.
In many council areas, this is the largest structure that can be erected without a council permit.

In an earlier post, I also suggested 100 square metres as a useful starting point.

The goal should be to design an integrated backyard food production unit.

A couple of posts ago, I suggested some parameters but let's not be too prescriptive at this stage.

What do others think?

Gary

[DuncanC]

Hi,

I'm particularly interested in what could be set up in an area 3m x 3m x 2.4 metres high.
In many council areas, this is the largest structure that can be erected without a council permit.

Gary

Hi Gary,

Just to clear things up for myself and others, the idea is to try to have as many aspects of IBFP, but to break the entire system down into units that fit in a 3m x 3m x 2.4m high structure?

Just as an example: fitting a vertical Quail farm in the corner, a small aquponics setup and a couple of satalite pots in one 'unit'. Chickens, worms, rabbits and another small aquaponics setup in another 'unit'.

I've included a very basic diagram of just some quail stacked vertically in a corner to give an idea of footprint.
http://img139.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ibfpunitexamplevg4.jpg

Cheers,

Duncan

[GaryD]

Hi Duncan,


Just to clear things up for myself and others, the idea is to try to have as many aspects of IBFP, but to break the entire system down into units that fit in a 3m x 3m x 2.4m high structure?

That's it in a nutshell. The challenge is to combine several aspects of food production into a single integrated unit.....or even a series of such units.....where the waste products of one process become the feedstock for other processes.

It's an expansion of the aquaponics integration.....to include other organisms like quail, chickens, ducks, worms, BSF, duckweed, rabbits, snails, fungi, etc......and taking account of waste heat, light, vertical stacking, etc.

Gary

[djs-sa]

I think we should be allowed four 3m x 3m x2.4m area's with a base land area of 15m x 5m.

what do other people think? this size would fit in the rear of a standard house block of about 750 square metres

[GaryD]

Hi Dale,

You can do whatever you want.......there are no rules. I only suggested 3m x 3m because, as I said, it is the largest structure you can put in a backyard in many council districts.

I imagine you could grow a very substantial amount of food in the four units that you've suggested.

What plants and animals would you suggest? How would you set the units up?

Gary

[grassroots]

I am starting my own IBFP system. I have some guppies in a fountain and old spa. I bought a bag of clay pebbles to filter the old spa, and fountain. When the bacteria grow I will plant veges in them. Since then I have purchased two day old laying chickens. The plan is to put the chickens on the garden beds before planting them out. I have bought two guinea pigs to eat the grass and clean up the old vegetable beds.

Has anyone fed guinea pig poo to the fish(perch etc) or is this a old wives tale?

The animals I plan to acquire and see how they work in my IBFP system.
Muscovy ducks quiet, raise their own young, meat and fertilising the garden.
Quail don't take up much room, eggs and meat.
Pigeon eggs and meat.
Australian native bees honey and pollination.
Fish to fertilise the veg and meat.
I have a backyard area of about 6 x 13 metres garden and 7 x 4 metres carport area.
Any input or ideas most welcome.

Gwen

[tumra]

I love the idea of a IBFP system, but its amazing how much time it takes to even produce some food in your backyard. I currently only grow (or actually help the old man) grow vegies in the garden and raising quails in the backyard, and this will take about 2 hours after work to look after. It will be interesting to see how people cope with the amount of time needed to run this system and become self sufficient.